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#Playstation2013

ps4 ps3 psVita

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#1 Tyrion

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 09:10

OK, we now have just under 38 hours until Sony reveals "The Future of PlayStation" - it's time for some wild speculation.

PS4, obviously, but what will it offer?

4K Output?
It'll probably be capable of outputting 4K, but no way will it natively render at that resolution.

Gaikai for backward compatibility?
Possibly for PS3, PS2 and PS1 will continue with "classics" PSN downloads. If Sony is serious then PS+ will come with a full streaming account for every PS3 game, everybody else will pop a disc to access their bought games.

Price?
I'm thinking £350-380 will be the spread for the UK.

Blocking second hand games?
This is possible, but I think unlikely, it would be hard to justify it being the first to announce and all Microsoft would have to to is drop its own plans to "win" the generation.

Vita connectivity?
Almost certainly, the new controller design leaks make me think the Vita will be usable as a first class controller, not an afterthought. Missing triggers will be an issue, but solvable by the back panel.

Games?
I'm thinking Last Guardian will be PS4, there will be a PS4 version of The Last of Us too. GT6 and Killzone4 would be good to round out the launch line up.

OK, guys, over to you. What am I wildly wrong on and what have I forgotten?
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#2 elmo

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 13:58

I'm really not sure on this one. Honestly. That launch line up sounds great but is it realistic. That would seriously be one of the best launch line ups of all time, i just cant see it being that strong.

When so you think it'll be out Tyrion?

#3 Tyrion

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 18:14

I'd love to see the reaction if they pulled an Apple and said "And it'll be in the shops on Friday" but that seems very unlikely.

More like Autumn, just in time for the Xmas feeding frenzy. If we're lucky Europe may also get it this year instead of having to wait for the Spring like last fucking time!

Oh and according to "sources" it's looking like £300 may be on the cards! I'll be there at midnight if that's the case. :-)
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#4 elmo

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 18:37

View PostTyrion, on 19 February 2013 - 18:14, said:

I'd love to see the reaction if they pulled an Apple and said "And it'll be in the shops on Friday" but that seems very unlikely.

More like Autumn, just in time for the Xmas feeding frenzy. If we're lucky Europe may also get it this year instead of having to wait for the Spring like last fucking time!

Oh and according to "sources" it's looking like £300 may be on the cards! I'll be there at midnight if that's the case. :-)


300 would be amazing. Lower than the wiiU and I'd be in.

#5 Sly Reflex

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 20:45

For me to bite...

They have to sort the pad out. The DS3 is an abomination. The thumbsticks feel loose and have horrible convex grips on them. One thing that bugs me is the power light on the front, which in games that are dark shines on the tv like a bloody laser pen. We all know about the triggers being useless. I've seen the prototype of the new PS pad and it looks like they solved some of the gripes I have from it, except they put a bloody great light similar to the ones found on move controllers. I think that could be potentially quite annoying.

Updates and downloads. Make them like LIVE or steam. I don't want to be locked into looking at an update screen crawl up. I don't want dash updates that I need to download seemingly every time I go on. They should be a few a year tops. Test these updates and make sure there's no bugs instead of patching them bit by bit.

Cross game and party chat is a must. I used to play quite a bit online on both 360 and PS3 and the distance between PS3 users astounded me. On 360 I'd have no problem jumping into a friend party or game and instantly firing up a conversation and being social, on PS3 I feel that the online infrastructure made it a lot harder for PS3 users to have something similar. It spoke volumes that game nights I arranged on PS3 would normally be filled with mostly predominantly 360 players. I'm not saying they have to change PSN so it's exactly the same as LIVE, but at least put the features in that lots of us have grown accustomed to.

Put a fucking headset in as standard. Even if it's a wired one.

#6 Tyrion

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 08:38

I have to disagree on the DualShock, I find it much more comfortable then the 360 controller. I've never had the triggers or thumbsticks slip out from under my fingers.

The original Sony Dual Analogue controller had concave tops to the sticks, but that was changed to convex for the first DualShock and stayed like that. You would have thought they'd done some market research on making that changeover.

However, if the "leaked" photos are anything to go by then a convex top with an inset ring is what we'll be having to get used to. I bet it'll piss off people on both sides of the argument! :-)
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#7 Tyrion

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 09:10

OK, new rumours this morning!


Live Gold like PSN access level for "most functionality"
If this is the case, than it'll replace PS+ and HAVE to include Gaikai BC for PS3 games. This may also allow a lower console price, making the £300 price level more likely.

Spectator mode for games you don't have
Watch your friends' games without having to own the game yourself. Again, Gaikai seems likely here. It's also a magnificent way to promote a game, one click from your friends list to watch their game, giving you a great look at the game and probably encouraging you to buy it.

Bundled PS Eye
Obviously for the "move" panel on the DualShock4, but could be used for all sorts of AR games.

Controllable by smartphone
Makes sense, Smartglass got a load of headlines, can't let that fall behind. However, PS3 has Remote Play over the Internet, imagine playing your PS4 on your iPad! Again, seems like a Gaikai type of thing.


This all seems likely, I'd be dissappointed if online play was covered by PSN Gold, but cross game chat, etc would be OK by me.

The biggie for me is the watch your friends' games features. I can see it being a great viral marketing tool, but I can see it eating your upload bandwidth if you're being watched by a few friends. It may have to be that your PS4 sends images to PSN and anybody can watch the stream via there.

Anyway, under 14 hours to go!
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#8 Sly Reflex

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 11:19

What do you think of having to pay for online gaming?

I've subbed to gold now for about 6 years or something, and every year I've felt less and less inclined to buy it. I still do because it works out at pennies per day and I get a lot of enjoyment out of it. I feel I'm getting less and less for my money though, especially compared to a PSN+ sub.

I don't know if I'd sub to two online services. if I do join this next gen and I end up buying both consoles, I certainly won't be buying online subs for both systems. It'll be just too much for me.

EDIT: I've been reading Eurogamer's comments. People are getting really angry/defensive over the whole thing. We don't even know the full facts yet. Idiots.

#9 Tyrion

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 13:58

It depends what you get for it and how much it is. I've never had a 360, so I've not paid for Live, but I've had a mobile for 14 years.

If you get basic online play, PS Store, etc without a subscription and you get an uprated PS+ with it, I'd be pretty happy.

The Gaikai thing interests me. If we can assume you get streamed PS3 backwards compatibility using Gaikai then there is an option for a subscription to give you access to the entire PS3 catalogue.

Without a subscription, you would get streamed PS3 BC for games you have the disc for, pop the disc in to authorise playing that game. With a subscription you get a Netflix/LoveFilm type of access to the entire range of PS3 games.

That seems like a valid use of Gaikai and a subscription to me and would be one in the eye for Microsoft if Sony can get the licenses sorted out with 3rd parties.

In fact with enough servers and emulation software, you could see older games platforms being supported too, like Nintendo did with the Wii Virtual Console.

The cool thing is, this doesn't have to be available to start with and could be deployed without any firmware updates to the PS4 its self.
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#10 Trigg

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 15:02

View Postelmo, on 19 February 2013 - 18:37, said:

300 would be amazing. Lower than the wiiU and I'd be in.


A reliable source hinted some time ago that they were looking to be cheaper than the Wii U which I thought was a stretch at the time and it still might prove to be the case. However, I think £300 would be awesome!

Watch_Dogs to be a launch title too maybe? Or at least to be released soon after the launch of the console which I expect to be late this year.
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#11 Sly Reflex

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 01:54

I watched the presentation. while I don't think they hit it out of the park like some have said, it looks like they've alleviated a lot of the problems I have with the PS3.

Now for MS to play some cards down, although I think they will be hard pressed to beat what Sony is offering in certain places.

#12 elmo

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 07:33

I'm really disappointed. We all expected to see the future of gaming last night and we saw absolutely nothing new. We didn't even see the bloody console.

No dashboard information, no new features other than streaming games. The share button is something OnLive did and it was fun for a day or so then never got used. I'm just massively underwhelmed. Also another sensor bar under my telly?

Still the new Dualshock looks decent.

#13 Tyrion

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 08:31

I don't know what you were expecting Elmo? Unless it was a holodeck with virtual hookers, it was never going to be the "future" of gaming.

We got a powerful spec with an x86 APU and a large unified memory, this will keep the devs happy and ensure there are no "it's difficult to port for" arguments. I've already heard rumours that the PS4 is easier to get things working on than the new Xbox.

For me that was a relief, PS3 has suffered for the Cell and the split memory architecture with dev teams having to focus much more on getting things working rather than getting some fun on screen.

We got a massive commitment to the social side of games, including mentions of cross game voice chat. That's something "the Internetz" have been shouting about for years.

We got Sony's version of SmartGlass, which has been around for years in Remote Play, but has never been taken advantage of like it was shown last night.

We got a commitment to PS3 BC via Gaikai. We also got a mention of BC back to PS1 the same way, on PS4 and Vita and possibly on PS3. Not as good as "in the box BC" but that was never going to be possible because of Cell.

We got a look at the new DualShock4, which was inevitable after the leaks, but it looks pretty good, an evolution of the DS3 with better triggers and at least a new shape for the tops of the analogue sticks. Again, both features gamers have been crying about for ages.

We saw a new version of the PS Eye, looks like a stereoscopic camera, there was a mention that it "knows" what's going on in the room. I know that sounds a hell of a lot like Kinect, but that's not a bad thing. With two systems out there we should get better games for both, remember Kinect2 should be coming with every Xbox720. It's not a gaming ghetto any more.

The big one for me was that Gaikai is so integrated into the PS4 that each one is a server and a client. The "Remote Help" feature could be pretty big, watching your mates, streaming games to a broadcast service, instant demos in the store. This seems to be the new heart of the PS4.

We also got told about background downloading, patching games without waiting, downloadable games will be playable before they are fully downloaded. No more installing downloaded games after downloading them - another player bugbear killed.

On top of that we got a load of games, Unreal Engine 4, some pretty impressive graphics and physics demos to get a feel for what the thing can do. We got a continued commitment to indie games, with self publishing mentioned. We even got a glimpse of the interface, a bit of desktop and a bit of the store.

For me it was a good presentation, nothing world changing, but then only someone with Sony koolaid for blood was expecting it to change the world in the first place.

What I saw was that Sony are still taking gaming seriously, games won't be on the back seat with the PS4 like they increasingly seem to be with Xbox. However, there will be wider entertainment support in there like there has been with every PlayStation since the original.

And you're complaining because you didn't see a box?
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#14 elmo

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 09:12

They failed to tell me what the PS4 is about. They failed to get me interested.

They showed the pad sure, but didn't break down what it could do other than 'share'.

They didn't show any of the UI, how the want you to control and use the console itself and showed a few demos of games that will appear on other consoles with one or two exceptions.

The Vita stuff is cool, if you own one or are a developer (what with it lacking two key buttons) otherwise you're looking at another £200 on top of the asking price to do what the WiiU already does.

We're not even sure if it'll have a physical media drive yet. Sony made a big song and dance about this but didn't really have much to say.

#15 elmo

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 09:16

Oh and can I add that the stuff about the PS4 downloading shit based on previous downloads scares the shit out of me.

#16 Tyrion

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 10:04

PS4 is about games, socialising and a bit of other media thrown in. I got that. It's a PlayStation, that's what they're all about.

How much does the UI matter once you're in the game? The bits they did show off look a lot like the new PS store.

The Vita already has mappings onto the rear panel for "PS Classics" games that need the L/R 2/3 buttons, that's not a problem although the extra price may be, but you will be able to remote play on your phone, tablet, PC or whatever. Hopefully not just PS certified ones either!

The specs that have come out afterwards say a 6X Blu-ray drive is present. There's no way they would dump the Blu-ray format for movies so it was almost a given.

And the "we think you'll like this" bit is just what Tivo and Virgin Media have been doing with TV for years. I suspect it'll only download the first part of the game and get the rest when you decide to buy it using that "play as it's downloading" capability so it shouldn't kill your bandwidth caps either.

Other than less of the shiny bullshit that Sony always covers their presentations with and a glimpse of the box, I'm not sure what you were expecting?

Edit: Almost forgot, it will play used games!
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#17 elmo

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 10:30

I was expecting a clear direction on where the PS4 is taking us. I was expecting them to present their vision of the future of gaming, where we are going.

What was presented was something that's trying to mimic what's been done before. Onlive, WiiU. The only thing that did look semi interesting (the camera in the pad) wasnt explained.

Then they showed Wii Music.

So yeah. Not great.

#18 Tyrion

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 11:28

There is no camera in the pad. There's a speaker, a headphone jack, a touchpad and a "light bar" for Move, but no camera.

They may have showed "Move Music", but that's not all they showed.

Onlive failed because streamed games was all there was, Gaikai is integrated into PS4 and used as part of an offering, not as a replacement for everything that came before it.

And the Wii U is just Remote Play by Nintendo, except it doesn't work over the Internet. I did that about five years ago with my PS3 and PSP.

The PS4/Vita Remote Play looks like working with all software, streamed, downloaded or local disc, across the Internet and will work on tablets and phones too. That's much bigger than the Wii U went for, and without a ridiculous controller/tablet affair when you're in front of the TV.

They showed the future of gaming, or their take on it at least, it's connected, always on and social. You may disagree, but that's what they showed. Plus like more megaflops and explosions and shit! :-)

There's a good analysis piece on MCV that breaks it down quite well for me. Xbox is going "media", Wii U is not capturing the imagination of gamers, it's possible PS4 is gonna take back the hardcore and everybody who has been disaffected by the last generation, maybe even without loosing the casuals.

I dunno, it's early days yet, but I'm optimistic that PlayStation will work best for me as my primary console starting this Winter. If they can sort out disc-authorised PS3 BC like I suggested they might above, then it's a no-brainer.

That I might have to upgrade to BT Infinity is the only major downside I can see.

Lets see how Microsoft responds, I just home this makes them focus more on games than they have recently.
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#19 elmo

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 12:22

It is early days. I'm not saying the console looks shit, I'm certainly not saying it will fail.

I just don't think last nights presentation was necessary in any way.

#20 Tyrion

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 13:50

Oh it was necessary, just not for us. Sony had to say something before Microsoft did.

That they didn't have a piece of industrial design to put in front of the world means nothing.

"The next generation starts when we say it does" - last time, it started before they said so because Microsoft got the jump on them.

This time, they have unveiled the philosophy, services, controller and games before Microsoft has evenadmitted that there is a next Xbox.

Sony will show the design of the PS4 box at E3 and steal Microsoft's thunder again, if as it seems, that's where it'll launch the new Xbox.

If the rumours of the Xbox delaying to next year are true, Sony will have won on all fronts. First to press, deflate the opposition, first to market. Probably playable at Eurogamer, maybe without Xbox competition.

In that regard, spoiler thought it may have been, last night was the first salvo in a year of getting in before Microsoft.

Just look at the tech headlines, nothing about Microsoft for weeks, apart from their own little spoiler in the Kinect "leak" of yesterday morning.

Perception wise, advantage Sony.
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